2011-03-27 IL: Äiti kaappasi lapsen

[sa ole rasisti]

"Jätti palutttamaata" ja "tapaamisajan päättyessä", joten kyllä tuo siltä kuulostaa, että isä oli se vanhempi, jonka luona tytär varsinaisesti asui.

Edit: seurasin linkiä: Isä oli siis lapsen laillinen yksinhuoltaja.

Tapuksesta en tiedä enempää kuin mitä juttuun on kirjoitettu, mutta noin yleisellä tasolla kuvittelin, että tuohon tilanteeseen päädytään (vastoin äidin tahtoa) lähinnä jos äiti on juoppo tai hullu...?

Kyllä, olet oikeassa. Hutkin ennenkuin tutkin.

[boshu]

Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriageable_age#Asia

Marriageable age (or marriage age) is the age at which a person is allowed to marry, either as of right or subject to parental or other forms of consent. The age and other requirements vary between countries. The marriage age should not be confused with the age of majority or the age of consent. The marriage age in a country may be below the age of majority and the age of consent that applies in that country. Additionally, the age at which a person is legally permitted to engage in sexual activity may be below the marriage age.

Spain: 18, 16 with parental consent.

Bangladesh: 21 for males and 18 for females, lunar calendar; penal sanctions for contracting under-age marriages, though such unions are not considered invalid.

Finland: 18, under 18 with the consent of the ministry of justice in extraordinary circumstances, in which case parents or other guardian must be heard, but actual parental consent is not required.

Venezuela: 18, 14 for females and 16 for males with parental consent.

Massachusetts (USA): 18 for first marriage, 14 (male) 12 (female) with parental and judicial consent.

Scotland: 16, 14 with parental consent.

What's wrong with Bangladeshi people?
The legal age of marriage in Bangladesh is 21 for male and 18 for female, but because there is no birth registration system, compliance with the
law is negligible. Truely early marriage is more common among the poorest girls in Bangladesh than girls from wealthy families.
Parents often feel pressured by cultural values to marry their girls at a young age when they can no longer afford
the cost associated with girls' schooling. This puts these girls at a double disadvantage; not only do they enter into
marriage as children, they are uneducated too. Women without formal education have little say in family decisions
both because they have no income of their own and because they lack the skills, confidence, and knowledge necessary
to negotiate with their husbands and in-laws. But if girls are able to stay in school through the secondary level, they
are often able to delay their marriage until they are adults.

WONDER WHY ON EARTH THE MOTHER THOUGHT THAT THE GIRL WILL BE FORCED INTO MARRIAGE? IS THAT PUREPLY A CONCERTN OR SHE WAS JUST REPEATING HERSELF, ONCE AGAIN?

[Kimmo Pirkkala]

WONDER WHY ON EARTH THE MOTHER THOUGHT THAT THE GIRL WILL BE FORCED INTO MARRIAGE?

Why do you think mother thought so?

Based on fact that most of the girls below 15 do get married in Bangladesh, I wouldn't think this speculation is totally out of question.

[boshu]

Näin ilkeästi pitää sanoa että naisen kannattaa kyllä miettiä kahdesti ennen kuin tehtailee lapsia eksoottisen ulkomaalaisen kanssa. Aluksi voi toki tuntua ihkulta, mutta jossain vaiheessa karu todellisuus saattaa lyödä päin kasvoja.

Vastuu on tietenkin yksilöllä, mutta se että yhteiskunta varauksettomasti hehkuttaa monikulttuurisuutta antaa monesti todella vääristyneen kuvan todellisuudesta. Oliskin tärkeää että vanhemmat ottaisivat roolia ja kertoisivat tyttärilleen myös riskeistä.

>>Näin ilkeästi pitää sanoa että naisen kannattaa kyllä miettiä kahdesti ennen kuin tehtailee lapsia eksoottisen ulkomaalaisen kanssa.

Here are some statistics for you:
http://www.stat.fi/til/ssaaty/2009/ssaaty_2009_2010-05-06_tau_001_en.html
http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsWorld.shtml

Better not to have children at all! Becasue there is over 50% chance that your marriage will
end up in a divorce; and there is little that is more traumatic for a child than the divorce of their parents.

Save the children from all these troubles by NOT having them. Not with an exotic foreigner or a FINN.

[Kimmo Pirkkala]

Save the children from all these troubles by NOT having them. Not with an exotic foreigner or a FINN.

Not a bad advice. Everyone (both men and women, both finns and foreigners) should always think very carefully when and with whom to have children. I think it's better to not have kids at all than to have them in a situation that you know will cause problems for the children.

[jopparai]

WONDER WHY ON EARTH THE MOTHER THOUGHT THAT THE GIRL WILL BE FORCED INTO MARRIAGE? IS THAT PUREPLY A CONCERTN OR SHE WAS JUST REPEATING HERSELF, ONCE AGAIN?

For example case like this I found fron UK news.

British girl 'rescued on way to forced marriage' in Bangladesh
A nine-year-old British girl was rescued on her way to the airport, bound for a forced marriage in Bangladesh, says a charity.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/3089398/British-girl-rescued-on-way-to-forced-marriage-in-Bangladesh.html

[thinkingmind]

Save the children from all these troubles by NOT having them. Not with an exotic foreigner or a FINN.

Are you following your advice yourself or do you have kids?

[Juffe]

OT pohdittavaa:
Mielenkiintoinen havainto tästä ketjusta. Yksi kirjoittaja kommentoi englanniksi, ja siitä eteenpäin muutkin antavat hänelle vastauksen englanniksi. Siitä huolimatta, että Boshukin on osoittanut ymmärtävänsä myös suomenkielisiä vastauksia, ja vaikka tällä foorumilla silloin tällöin pyydetään kääntämään englanninkielisiä lähteitä suomeksi, eli englanti tuottaa joillekin hankaluuksia. Kertooko tämä jotakin Suomessa vallitsevista kieliasenteista?

[boshu]

WONDER WHY ON EARTH THE MOTHER THOUGHT THAT THE GIRL WILL BE FORCED INTO MARRIAGE? IS THAT PUREPLY A CONCERTN OR SHE WAS JUST REPEATING HERSELF, ONCE AGAIN?

For example case like this I found fron UK news.

British girl 'rescued on way to forced marriage' in Bangladesh
A nine-year-old British girl was rescued on her way to the airport, bound for a forced marriage in Bangladesh, says a charity.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/3089398/British-girl-rescued-on-way-to-forced-marriage-in-Bangladesh.html

These are extreme cases and cannot be used as an example to generalize or stereotype the whole nation.

Likewise one cannot quote one such example "http://www.hs.fi/keskustelu/aihealue/Kotimaa/ketju/2015479/?page=5&perPage=20" which says ....

""Vuonna 1990 tehdyn tutkimuksen mukaan 0,5 prosenttia alle 15-vuotiaista tytöistä oli joutunut isän tekemän insestin uhriksi. Niemi-Kiesiläisen mukaan Suomessa vain muutama insestitapaus on edennyt tuomioistuimeen saakka.""

..and dismiss all Finnish fathers based on this! Its a horrible example and I apologize but my point is we cannot live on exceptions.

[Kimmo Pirkkala]

Extreme cases? Exceptions?

Marriage in Bangladesh is illegal under the age of 18 -- for both boys and girls -- but a World Vision report released this week found that 52.5 percent of girls were married before they turned 15

http://www.sify.com/news/bangladesh-s-child-brides-defenceless-despite-law-news-international-jegxcFgiihb.html

[Kikken]

Better not to have children at all! Becasue there is over 50% chance that your marriage will
end up in a divorce; and there is little that is more traumatic for a child than the divorce of their parents.

Well I don't agree with you. Maybe in Finland there isn't much that is worse for a child than a divorce between the parents. But that's because the children's rights are generally very good in Finland, compared to other nations.

I'm not saying that a Finn should not marry a foreigner. But it's naive to believe that children's and women's rights in other cultures are generally as good as in Finland.

[jopparai]

...................... I apologize but my point is we cannot live on exceptions.

You have a good point. But in case of Bangladesh, as You can see in Wekkuli's mail, we don't speak about exception. Anyway You are probably right about this case, what comes to mother's instability. Otherwise father would not have got custody of the daughter. All the rest is pure speculation. Well, that's what this forum is for.

[thinkingmind]

Lapsikaappauksiin liittyvä juttu tämän illan A-studiossa.

Tiukkoja luonnehdintoja kuinka ulkomaalaiset miehet pelottelevat rasismi-kortilla ja saavat suomalaiset sosiaaliviranomaiset tanssimaan pillinsä mukaan rasismi-syyttelyn pelossa.
Yhden kaapatun lapsen äiti kertoo kuinka hänen miehensä uhkaili mm. Amnestyllä ja Haagilla jotta sai asiat järjestymään mielensä mukaan ja lopulta kaappasi lapsen.

Kerrotaan myös kuinka lähi-idästä ja pohjois-afrikasta ei yleensä ikinä saada kaapattuja lapsia takaisin ja kuinka näissä maissa mies päättää KAIKEN naisen ja lasten puolesta joten paikallisten viranomaisten mukaan mitään ongelmaa ei ole jos lapsikaappaaja on mies.

Ohjelma kertoo selvästi etupäässä muslimimiehistä vaikka välillä käytetäänkin laajempia termejä kuten maahanmuuttaja ja yhtenä ongelmana mainitaan venäjä.