2010-05-10 Italia: Milanon pormestari tulilinjalla maahanmuuttopuheistaan

[kohmelo]

Milanon pormestarin olisi kannattanut jäättää mainitsematta, että "Laittomat maahanmuuttajat syyllistyvät rikoksiin."
Pormestari oli puhujana Milanon katollisen yliopiston maahanmuutto konferenssissa ja vastalauseiden myrsky oli valmis.

Siitä kuka syyllistää ketä ja mistä voi lukea itse artikkelista, mutta jutun lopussa on jotain paljon mielenkiitoisempaa.

Mainitussa konferenssia julkaistiin myös tutkimus maahanmuuton ja urbaanin kurjistumisen yhteydestä. Tutkimuksen mukaan Ranskassa tapahtuneet vuoden 2005 maahanmuuttajamellakat ovat mahdollisia myös Italian räjähdysvaarassa olevissa kaupungeissa. Tutkimuksen mukaan Italialla on lyhyempi historia maahanmuutossa kuin Ranskalla, mutta se on ollut huomattavasti nopeampaa.

http://www.ansa.it/web/notizie/rubriche/english/2010/05/10/visualizza_new.html_1791113909.html

Immigrant-crime link criticized
Milan mayor under fire for comments on jobless foreigners

(ANSA) - Milan, May 10 - Milan Mayor Letizia Moratti came under fire on Monday after linking jobless immigrants to higher crime rates. Speaking at a conference on immigration at the Milan Catholic University, Moratti said foreigners living in Italy without permits were likely to commit offences. "Illegal immigrants without regular work normally commit crimes," said Moratti, a member of Premier Silvio Berlusconi's People of Freedom (PdL) party. The former education minister's remarks prompted an immediate response.

The conference audience reacted angrily, with disapproving mutters and catcalls, while numerous opposition politicians voiced criticism as the day progressed. Livia Turco, who heads the Immigration Forum of the largest opposition group the Democratic Party (PD), reprimanded Moratti for her "irresponsible words". "These will only end up feeding oversimplifications and fears," said Turco, saying Moratti's role as mayor of one of Italy's biggest cities made her remarks particularly serious.

"An irregular immigrant is not someone who commits crimes but someone who needs a residence permit," she added.

Other PD figures expressed similar views. PD Senator Roberto Della Seta said he would expect "more responsible and moderate language" from someone in Moratti's post. Another PD Senator Roberto Di Giovan Paolo pointed out "the number of offences committed in Italy by foreigners is far lower than those carried out by Italians". Gaoussou Ouattara of the Radical Party called Moratti's comments "an insult to immigrant communities", while Senator Giuliana Carlino of the small Italy of Values party said the mayor had "seriously overstepped the mark". "Someone who views all irregular immigrants as criminals is a racist in the purest form who fails to recognize everything that immigrants do for the city of Milan," she said. But other members of parties within the centre-right majority coalition defended the mayor. Interior Minister Roberto Maroni, who also gave a speech at the conference, said Moratti had been misquoted by the press. "She said something else and I don't think she quite made the comparison that is being suggested," he said. PdL MP Margherita Boniver said the entire incident had been blown out of proportion. "The opposition has, once again, wasted no opportunity to erupt, just like the Icelandic volcano, spewing out an enormous cloud of lies and falsehoods," said Boniver. The daylong conference in Milan's Catholic University, attended by senior politicians, church figures and those working with immigrants, looked at several aspects of immigration in Italy. In his address, Maroni focused on a report published at the conference examining the link between immigration and urban decay. "This research clearly tells us that what happened in the French banlieues risks happening here," said the minister, referring to rioting among first and second-generation French immigrants in 2005. The report by the Milan Catholic University's Sociology Department, backed by the Interior Ministry, warned there was "a high risk potential of sudden explosions" in Italian cities. The report pointed out that although Italy has a shorter history of immigration than France, this was now growing at a much faster rate, up 10% in 2010 compared to 2006 levels.

Commenting on the report, Vatican 'interior minister' Antonio Maria Veglio stressed that integration was the best way to address current difficulties and prevent future problems. "It is critical that models of integration are studied that focus on values of mutual understanding and dialogue," he said. "More than ever before we are in need of a society that expands its spaces of belonging and participation, while restricting those of marginalization and exclusion," he said. The issue of integration has been in the media spotlight over recent months, following two headline incidents in which foreigners were involved in violence. The first of these saw two days of clashes between foreign farmhands and locals in a Calabrian town in January after Italian youths shot at three African labourers. Over 50 people were injured during the ensuing riots, which saw immigrants shot at, beaten with iron bars and run over, while cars were alight. The second incident involved ethnic rioting on the outskirts of Milan in February, following the murder of a 19-year-old Egyptian immigrant by a gang of Latin Americans.

This sparked a violent demonstration among North Africans who broke store windows and overturned cars in one of Milan's most multiethnic neighbourhoods.

[hammerzeit]

Tämä on kyllä niin hillitön ja takuuvarma syy-seuraus-suhde, että se menee melkein parodian puolelle.

"Maahanmuuttajat ovat väkivaltaisia."
"Mitä? Ja saatana olla! Paikat paskaksi!"
*Mellakoi viikon*

[acc]

Milanon pormestarin olisi kannattanut jäättää mainitsematta, että "Laittomat maahanmuuttajat syyllistyvät rikoksiin."
Pormestari oli puhujana Milanon katollisen yliopiston maahanmuutto konferenssissa ja vastalauseiden myrsky oli valmis.

Jos tulee maahan laittomasti, niin jo sekin on rikos.  Jos ihminen on valmis tekemään rikoksen eli saapumaan maahan laittomasti, lienee selvää, että kynnys tehdä rikoksia on jatkossakin alhaisempi.  Milanon pormestari olisi siis voinut sanoa, että jokainen laiton maahanmuuttaja on rikollinen ja se rikos oli laiton maahantulo.

[herranen]

Pari huomionarvoista kohtaa :

An irregular immigrant is not someone who commits crimes but someone who needs a residence permit

Italiassakin ongelma laittoman maahanmuuton ongelmiin on antaa mamuille oleskeluluvat. Tässä vaiheessa kannattaa huomata, että pormestari oli huolissaan laittomista maahanmuuttajista joilla ei ole työtä. Käsittääkseni tämä ongelma ei välttämättä poistu oleskeluluvalla.

the number of offences committed in Italy by foreigners is far lower than those carried out by Italians

Ilmeisesti taaskin asiasta saa huolestua vasta kun vähemmistö aiheuttaa enemmän ongelmia kuin enemmistö. Toisaalta tuossa on vahva osoitus yhteisestä eurooppalaisesta kulttuurista jossa kunkin maan suvaitsevaisto apinoi typeriä argumentteja toisiltaan.

[Ernst]

Milanon pormestarin olisi kannattanut jäättää mainitsematta, että "Laittomat maahanmuuttajat syyllistyvät rikoksiin."
Pormestari oli puhujana Milanon katollisen yliopiston maahanmuutto konferenssissa ja vastalauseiden myrsky oli valmis.

Jos tulee maahan laittomasti, niin jo sekin on rikos.
[/quote
Tuo on totta, mutta vain Italiassa. Meillä esimerkiksi maahantulossa ilmoitetuista vääristä tiedoista ei voi rangaista.

  Jos ihminen on valmis tekemään rikoksen eli saapumaan maahan laittomasti, lienee selvää, että kynnys tehdä rikoksia on jatkossakin alhaisempi.

Tuo on totta. Järjestäytyneessä yhetiskunnassa ei voi elää sen ehdoilla ilman henkilöllisyyttä. Siksi ajautuu vääjäämättä laitomuuksiin. Siis muihinkin laittomuuksiin kuin maahantulorikoksiin.

  Milanon pormestari olisi siis voinut sanoa, että jokainen laiton maahanmuuttaja on rikollinen ja se rikos oli laiton maahantulo.

Totuuden puhujia ei juuri koskaan rakasteta varauksettomasti.

[Don Pedro]

"An irregular immigrant is not someone who commits crimes but someone who needs a residence permit," she added.

Aha. Laittomasti maahan tullut = tehnyt rikoksen. Jos tekee toita, tekee niita pimeasti eli laittomasti = rikos. Jos ei tee toita, milla elattaa itsensa? Rikoksilla.

Mista naita idiootteja riittaa?

Ja seuraava:

Another PD Senator Roberto Di Giovan Paolo pointed out "the number of offences committed in Italy by foreigners is far lower than those carried out by Italians"

Ihan tosi? Ei tata argumenttia viela olekaan nahty kuin kaikissa maissa. Mites ne prosentuaaliset osuudet mahtaa menna?